Mailing list archives : pcb-rnd

ID:4220
From:Evan Foss <ev...@gmail.com>
Date:Wed, 24 Jun 2020 16:38:50 -0400
Subject:Re: [pcb-rnd] Off topic (maybe) - Spice simulator
in-reply-to:4219 from Gabriel Paubert <pa...@iram.es>
replies: 4223 from N <ni...@gmail.com>
It's also worth noting that because of the nature of plasma it's going
to change DC vs AC. I saw a few hundred volt DC arc flash once. I
don't recommend it.
 
On Wed, Jun 24, 2020 at 4:31 PM Gabriel Paubert <paubert@iram.es> wrote:
>
> On Wed, Jun 24, 2020 at 01:01:19PM -0400, gene glick wrote:
> > Can't you take a zener diode model and crank up the breakdown voltage?
>
> I don't think so, it has hysteresis, even worse than negative dynamic
> resistance found in tunnel diodes. At least the model has to switch
> between two states depending on past conditions.
>
> If you find a working diac model, it might be a reasonable starting
> point:
>
> https://www.electronicdesign.com/power-management/article/21798585/model-diacs-and-triacs-for-acline-control
>
> as you can see, the model includes a flip flop.
>
>         Gabriel
>
>
> > Alternatively, make a voltage controlled switch that turns on at the needed
> > voltage. I think a voltage dependent current source might also do the job.
> >
> > I'll bet there are many other ways to do this as well.
> >
> > On Wed, Jun 24, 2020, 12:22 PM Robin Laing <MeSat@telusplanet.net> wrote:
> >
> > > On 23/06/2020 08:20, Anthony Tuttle wrote:
> > > > LTspice has a neon lamp model that can work without being too prone to
> > > > convergence issues. I have also used R={expression} as the resistance
> > > > value in resistors to simulate switches and this may be workable for an
> > > > improvised discharge model.
> > > >
> > > > There are spice models for GDTs, you may have to contact the
> > > > manufacturer directly to gain access. They are never perfect but there
> > > > has been some work on advanced GDT models.
> > > >
> > > > On Tue, Jun 23, 2020 at 1:41 AM stefan <stefan.schippers@gmail.com
> > > > <mailto:stefan.schippers@gmail.com>> wrote:
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >>     Hello,
> > > >>
> > > >>     I am involved with a project that will involve high voltage pulse
> > > >>     circuit design and I am looking for a circuit simulator that will
> > > >>     give
> > > >>     us an accurate representation of a circuit.
> > > >>
> > > >>     Needs to work with spark gap technology as that is the present
> > > >>     design.
> > > >>     Maybe gas discharge tube as well.
> > > >>
> > > >>     Presently one member of the team is trying to use Multisim from NI
> > > >>     but I
> > > >>     am wondering if there may be a better package.
> > > >>
> > > >     NGSPICE developers are doing a good job,
> > > >     ngspice netlists may contain capacitors, resistors, inductors with
> > > >     arbitrary expressions about their value.
> > > >     Moreover the 'B source' allows any type of voltage/current source
> > > >     with arbitrary expressions.
> > > >
> > > >     Combining these elements a model for a gas discharge/breakdown can
> > > >     be created.
> > > >     The big issue is not the simulator itself, but the quality of the
> > > model:
> > > >
> > > >     1) ability to accurately describe the device.
> > > >     2) simulator must converge to a solution.
> > > >
> > > >     Breakdown devices (devices with infinite resistance that start
> > > >     conducting with very low resistance when a voltage threshold is
> > > >     reached) are famous for giving convergence issues. This usually
> > > >     happen due to poor model description. A current limit must be
> > > >     included in the equations (no physical device can sustain 1e15 Amp
> > > >     of current :-) ).
> > > >
> > > >     Stefan
> > > >
> > >
> > > Thank you to all.
> > >
> > > The breakdown is where I ran into problems with a model years ago.  It
> > > was quicker to just setup an test bed and try it.  Don't do enough
> > > design work to take the time to learn the simulator.  Same reason that
> > > Multisim is being used.
> > >
> > > Robin
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
>
>
>
>
 
 
-- 
https://github.com/evanfoss
 
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Reply subtree:
4220 Re: [pcb-rnd] Off topic (maybe) - Spice simulator from Evan Foss <ev...@gmail.com>
  4223 Re: [pcb-rnd] Off topic (maybe) - Spice simulator - sparc model from N <ni...@gmail.com>